An Ideology of Struggle.
My last post invited many comments. In a way, the more than one hundred comments obliterated the first two sardonic remarks to my article. The first two mordant comments had suggested derisively, that I take a rest. I am being incoherent they say. Fortunately their views were not shared by subsequent comments. Those who followed later were interested to offer views and constructive criticisms. In the end, this article has generated a lively debate. To me, this reflects the emerging character of Malaysian society. The first two comments represent the old and discredited way by which those who hold power explain away things. The preferred way of these dysfunctional autocrats is to impose their views on an unquestioning public. Indeed they assume and hold the belief that the audience to whom they wish to engage are just muted digits. Thus those who provide a medium for participatory and contending ideas to jostle with one another are told to shut up. The purveyors of this approach will be things of the past. It will give way to an atmosphere of inclusive discourse. People challenge ideas put forth. They find meaning in debating issues confronting them. By doing so, they demolish the xenophobic monopoly long held exclusively by those wishing to mentally subjugate others. The post was meant to stir up interest. In questioning some of the basis on which Malay society operates, I hope we can enhance our understanding on what makes a society progressive. The remarks by one commentator, which I reproduced here, deserve some response. I have broken the comments into 2 sections. The first baffles me because it assumes away the glaring economic disparity between races. The very reason why the government carried out affirmative economic policies is because they don't accept all this while that it does not matter which section of society is richer than the other. The second baffles me even more, because it seems to unreservedly accept this scheme of things. Both are not healthy for our society. The bonding element that cements our society must be economic justice. We debate about this later. But the more frightening message in these comments (perhaps unintended by the author) is the sense of hopelessness and unwillingness to struggle to make things better. It's ok to accept disparity and social injustices. It is sufficient and healthy for society if one section is better off. Where is our ideology of struggle? Our leaders speak of life being a struggle or that our struggle is never completed, yet the import of the meaning of such phrases is lost on many who are yet unmoved. Can we accept a life that is devoid of a constant struggle to achieve? What scares me more and I hope I am wrong here, is the subtle suggestion that we accept whatever is foisted on us as a fulfilment without having to resort to an ideology of struggle. As a result we accept things as they are. Can we live in such a placid society? Pushed to the extreme, in the particular case of the Malays, while we want material benefits and economic advancements, we are contented with unfair economic arrangements. That its ok if we are left behind, that in the name of one Malaysia, as long as we can at least share in the happiness to see one section of the community pulls ahead of us, our society is healthy. What about the portion of society left behind? Are we contented in defending the status quo? Hence we have a society divided. One section is composed of the fortunate ones because we allowed them to become so, the other, consists of the less fortunate because we allowed to become so too. How do we explain this to be so? The inadvertent answer is because the Malaysian environment has made this so. The question is, if the environment that presides over all of us is common, how is it that one section can pull ahead of us, while the rest stagnates? Could it be that the section that pulls ahead has inside them, an ideology of struggle imbued? That perhaps the response to the Toynbeean challenge within that section of society left behind has not been adequate?
45 comments:
Cara dia struggle dengan cara yg tak sepatutnya...
Bila dia dapat, dia mempunyai (pegang kuat) sampai org lain tak leh bernafas.. Sila lihat perkara yg terjadi di Perak, Nizar macam boneka aja, yg berkuasa sapa. That kind of attitude.
Mungkin saya kena berkias begini:-
Kalau gladiator berlawan, beliau mempunyai ciri2 heroic, cara dan gaya dengan sifat2 dan kredibiliti pejuang; manakala seorang lagi dengan taktik kotor dan tipu muslihat, panggil geng atau tetiba boleh datang singa dan naga dlm filem) memberi attack2 yg tak dijangka kepada sang heroic tadi.
Apa akan jadi?
So, walau pun sang gladiator heroic dan tangkas berlawan, semangat tingginya saja yg boleh membawa kemenangan.
Semangat dan kesungguhan yg perlu ada dalam setiap melayu, dalam erti kata sebenarnya untuk menangani masalah ini.
Tapi, tak semua melayu punya semangat begitu. Cara perlu difikirkan bagaimana nak instill ciri2 tersebut dalam jati diri melayu.
Belajarlah semangat juang yg ada dalam diri gladiator itu.
Inilah yg kita penat2 tulis kat blog atok ni. Memperjuangkan hak melayu. Kalau bukan kita, sapakah lagi.
Membuka peluang sama rata pada semua diketika melayu masih mundur, bukan cara yg betul.
Perlembagaan yg kita ada sudah betul. Cuma perlaksanaan nya dan Melayu2 yg duduk2 di posisi2 tertentu telah memusnahkannya, sedangkan kaum2 lain punya sikap2 yg positif dalam mengharungi hidup.
Sad to say, walaupun mereka2 ini bukan Islam, tapi sikap bekerja dan cara bersaing mereka sama seperti yg dianjurkan oleh Islam. They have taken all the best part in Islam, unknowingly.
Sayangnya akidah mereka yg tiada.
Kalau tidak saya yakin mereka akan menjadi satu bangsa yang unggul di dunia ini.
Berbanding dengan kita punya akidah, tapi tidak punya sikap2 bekerja yg boleh buat kita berdaya saing.
Mereka mengambil atau mewarisi cara2 yg terbaik seperti dianjurkan islam (tanpa mengetahuinya) manakala org melayu Islam pula tidak mengadoptasikan ciri terbaik islam dalam kehidupan tapi percaya kepada Allah.
Dato,
Don't worry about the sardonic remarks and the unsubstantiated 1-2
liners. This kind exists everywhere; just ignore them. Your blog is always read and participated by many thinking Malays with experience in various fields of activity. We always have a lively debate.
It's fine to have an ideology of struggle. But what matters most are delivering the goods and how much delivered.
There are always the pros and cons and disagreements along the way. Economists are not even agreed as to what caused the Great Depression of the 30s. What is important is how and what they got out of it.
We are now in poor economic health. But do we put aside NEP because it dampens competition? No. What is economic justice when 60% of the population have only 20%of corporate wealth? And not counting other forms of wealth. Isn't that an unfair economic arrangement?
We have huge wealth disparity among the races and wealth disparity among the Malays. The first must continue to be rectified by the NEP, the second by changes in the implementation of the NEP. The share of the cake allotted to the Malays - distribute them wider, find ways to do so. Avoid cronyism, get rid of money politics.
It's not ok to accept disparity and social injustices. The other side may think it unjust to continue the NEP? No. It's unjust not to continue it. They already have so much wealth. They should accept NEP if they expect a true Bangsa Malaysia to emerge. We cannot have a Bangsa Malaysia if the economic disparity is not greatly reduced. The entire premise of the NEP when conceived in the 70s was the income disparity problem. We cannot expect mutual respect and harmonious relations until that comes about. We cannot expect cordiality even among Malays when those staying in rented link houses are not given the chance to have tyhe means to buy their own houses. We know that blogger Demi Negara has expounded the Bangsa Malaysia concept very well. I am very sure that with income disparity greatly lessened, the Malays would be more amenabe to the others.
Maybe the response to the challenge within that society is inadequate. But everybody knows that our community has a shorter history, and whatever comes with it, than the others. This is no excuse to be lackadaisical. But let's be fair to ourselves. We have tried, our kind. Thanks to TDM, an elite Malay business class has emerged, although mainly his cronies. 1-2 became billionaires. But the wealth should have been spread out. The new government must spread it out. 60% of the GA delegates were said to be contractors. So many have delved into the contracting business, construction, supplies etc. Bobbing up and down over the years. Competing with those with 1,000+ years experience. Let's be realistic and admit we cannot compete at par. We need the NEP.
We don't have a welfare state system like in the UK. Cheap council flats, free health facilities. I have often been flabbergasted seeing poor orang kampong having to wait for a relative to put out some kind of gurantee prior to an operation costing a few thousand Ringgit at government hospitals. This is certainly not social justice. The new government must tackle this kind of things, irrespective of the ideology of struggle or administration it may want to label itself.
SM,
Your "the sense of hopelessness and unwillingness to struggle to make things better" comment.
I hear the same things once upon a time. About how principles will not put food on the table. About cutting corners being necessary.
Do I believe in them? I am shamed to say I did, once.
Until I saw what cutting corners and living without principles does to you.
These days I smile whenever I meet the selfsame people. I don't discard them from my life: but I keep in mind that once you are stuck with cutting corners is the day your life is on a leash.
Unfortunately, a whole lot of us (it seem, but I may well be mistaken) thinks this leash is necessary to put food on the table.
And sadly, these people are those who professes to be muslims.
Imagine that.
What is the use of "Harta melimpah ruah" when you know full well its from haram sources?
But Rezeki halal - no matter how insignificant it may seems - will calm your spirits always.
I always think of this whenever it seems that everything is hopeless.
Itulah Melayu, bila semuanya hopeless baru fikir Allah..
Anyway, at least belum terlambat.. So next time when things turnaround, you akan lebih bersyukur dan lebih memahami kuasa Allah, lagi lebih dari semasa keadaan hopeless itu..
it is acceptable for assistance and preferential treatment to be given to parties to kick off an initiative...but it should not go on forever.The "premium" shld be inbuilt into programmes that will lead towards building capacity and being competitive;and not just pure handouts.
To ensure the success of the programmes...it must be structured carefully and with able participants who hv the knowledge and willlingness to work harder then the next guy.
Not everyone can or want to be a contractor but there will never be a shortage of guys who wants contracts.Pls differentiate between the 2.
Sdr Kuldeep
Apa kah sdr fikir Melayu boleh capai tahap kekayaan dan kebolehan berniaga hampir dengan Cina? Secrara realistik nya?
Bukan kah sejengkal Melayu maju dalam perniagaan, Cina akan maju 3-4 jengkal?
Bagaimana kalau itu keistimewaan tidak di kekalkan dan Melayu merosot hingga saperti awal 70an? Bukan tak boleh merosot, dahulu akibat Krisis Kewangan kekayaan Melayu 30% sudah merosot ke 20% bukan?
Sekian sahaja pertanyaan saya. Terima kasih.
Kata kata seperti ajaran Islam tidak sesuai lagi dengan arus kemodenan dunia hari ini atau sembahyang tidak akan buat kita jadi kaya dan seumpamanya adalah kata kata yang sangat biadab dan menghina Allah, pencipta seluruh alam.
Ingatlah teman, kita boleh melupakan kematian, tetapi kematian tetap akan terjadi bagi kita. Hanya masanya saja yang akan mene ntukan bila kita akan kembali ke alam barzakh. Janganlah menjadi orang yang bodoh, siapakah orang
yang bodohitu? Mereka itulah orang yang ingin melawan Tuhan Rabbul alamin.
Apabila anda enggan melaksanakan suruhan Tuhan bererti anda ingin melawan arahan Tuhan. Sewaktu di sekolah anda tertakluk dengan undang-undang sekolah, dalam pekerjaan anda tertakluk dengan undang-undang yang di lakar oleh majikan anda, di dalam negeri anda tertakluk di bawah undang-undang negara anda.
Begitu taksub sekali anda terhadap undang-undang itu hingga terlalu prihatin takut kalau melanggar undang-undang itu. Apabila anda berpijak di bumi ini, anda juga tertakluk dengan undang-undang yang telah di gubal oleh yang
menjadikan bumi ini.
Taman laranganNya adalah perkara-perkara yang telah diharamkan bagi hamba-hambaNya di muka bumi ini.
Sama samalah kita memohon agar Allah sentiasa memberi kita
petunjuk di atas jalan yan g benar dan kekuatan agar sentiasa dapat menjaga lidah kita.
Anon 17:21
Kalau anda kuat dengan agama dan ajaran Islam, mengapa menomah orang "menjadi bodoh" dsb nya. Anda pun sudah berdo'a untuk "menjaga lidah kita".
Dia keluarkan pendapat nya, bukan mencaci Islam secara terus menerus.
Anda boleh tak setuju dan lawan pendapat nya tapi gunakan lah hujah2 yang terus menerus menjawab atau menapikan pendapat nya. Dengan cara ini orang boleh menghormatkan anda dan mungkin dengar cakap anda.
Mari kita berbincang secara matang dan waras di blog Dato yang di hormati ramai ini.
Of course Malays can be as good or even better than the non Malays...we fail only because we as a group are not sincere and forget that we hv to struggle to succeed..its like running on a treadmill>keeping the same pace will leave you only on the same spot.
We fail because we don't trust each other..do not network nor strive to develop our own "supply chain" but prefer the easy way to get things done.
We are quick to condemn our own ppl but more forgiving on others...Do u think YTL,Gamuda,Ananda,Vincent Tan,Sunway Cheah,Mines Lim hv not been bestowed with special assistance?
We fail cos with every new "Umno" leadership a new breed of cronies will work to destroy watever hv been done previously in order to fill the created vacuum.
We fail becos opportunities are not given to the right ppl.Why is TSR given a Rm 1.7 billion project in Jv with Luth?on Luth's land as well?...and who do u think will be calling the shots in TSR in regards to awards of subcontracts?supply contracts?
And success shld never be measured on "short term" only but MUST include the potential for FUTURE growth.
If u want Malay success stories all of us can contribute by naming a few...I can cite Mazlan of MMVitaoils...and Dahlan the chocolate King.Can u name a few?
Lets begin to appreciate our own ppl and try to replicate their success.
kuldeep
With due respect and not to belittle the successful Malays, I have to say -
You yourself said we fail because: we are not sincere .. forget to struggle .. don't trust one another .. do not network .. do not develop our own supply chain .. prefer the easy way .. new leadership new cronies will destroy .. opportunities not given to the right people .. etc, etc.
Do you think these, many of which are manifestations of Malay racial characteristics, will disappear in time to come? Early enough for us to catch up or at least be near the Chinese economically? I don't think so.
We appreciate our own people's successes. But, my friend, it's simply not enough. Daim is a billionaire but we are not even 20% on the corporate wealth tally. What about other aspects of wealth? We must remember the others don't remain stagnant when we progress. In fact, they'll move perhaps even faster when we may be just gaining momentum.
Let's be realistic, my friend. No reason to be malu with the NEP. The others are forever wanting more and more. The moment they become citizens they want equal rights. Now they want our rights to go. Why do we allow that when we badly need them?
Tan Siew Sin had already said the Malays have been "generous enough" - at least on two occasions in the not-so-distant past: agreeing to non-Malay citizenship at Merdeka, relaxing citizenship rules for them after Merdeka. Later occasions include agreeing on vernacular schools. When Malay is the official language of Malaysia and Mandarin is the official language of China. Why are we being generous endlessly? What's the matter with us? What do we get in return?
I don't understand much about ideology of struggle but I agree with you on those deplorable characteristics you spoke about. Don't we want our descendents to taste the benefits of NEP because, among other reasons, the non-Malay descendents will taste citizenship forever? We suffered since the days of Sri Vijaya. For goodness sake, let's keep our rights.
no sir...these are not characteristics of the real malay...its the tendencies of the opportunistic few who became successful peddling their knowwho..
Mazlan and Dahlan >> they succeed thru knowledge,creativity and focussed business sense...and they are building malay networks and supply chains...and they are competitive.
so..its for the leadership to change..to begin to recognise and nurture,assist real talents within a "business orientated" structure..so that we can develop our strengths and be competitive..and must not be fixated by creating billionaires but rather middle sized biz entities with good assets,strong mgmt and with the potential for growth.
If NEP is deemed as a permanent crutch then there won't be much left of the cake by the time our kids grow up.
To me the NEP is an implementation of the agreed upon (among founding communities of the new nation) so-called social contract due to the need of the time. The limit of which is in the wording in the relevant areas in the constitution.
Intensity of implementations can vary increase or decrease or even ceased once economic parity is reached if it is agreed upon by the Malays/other-natives. To me the question of fairness does not arise as it is the part alloted to the Malays/other-natives in the constitution as the son of the soil.
Thus far I think this is confused with the abused in the implementation of the NEP which is the real issue at hand.
With due respect to those truly ‘berdikari’ed Malay M’sians, who r successful, this is NOT for u.
“….we fail because: we are not sincere …” adequately summed up the predicaments faced by most of the Malay M’sians!
Why?
Simple!
Like it or not, the Malays (sorry, Malay M’sians r whom I meant), r tied to the Islam faith for eternity, whether they want it or not. U can be a born Malay, but if u do not follow the Islam faith then nobody knows who u actually r! And not all Muslims r Malay M’sian!
Been a Muslim is not a problem. Neither is been a Malay. But been a Malay M’sian, posts a big dilemma in following the sequence of ABN (Agama, Bangsa, Negara) that almost all them r shouting longingly, if given a chance.
ABN means u put yr faith on top priority, follow by yr race, then yr country. Does it mean that if there happened to be a SERIOUS conflict involving M’sia with another country, religion becomes the main guiding factor of whether we fight or not to fight to protect our land? Even if we r the wronged party? No?
Islam is a righteousness dogma. Under IT’S teachings, all men r equal. Race, social standings and wealth r of NO consequences to ITS judgments. No?
Then what about NEP? And its implementation? There lies the biggest hypocritical challenge that facing the sincerity of the Malay M’sian!
If one was realistic, practical & a true Muslim, ‘malu’ is the least of the behavioral showing that one should worry!
Tan Siew Sin was a politician. What he said about the Malay generosity was taken out of context. Like all politicians he played the tune to the ‘needs’ of the political situations then. He was playing the same political tunes just like the current umno does – fear, doubt & intimation (FDI).
At that not so long distant time continuum, mca was facing very big challenges from the opposition parties such as the Labour party. Tan knew he was losing major Chinese supports due to many Chinese issues, not least the Chinese educational ‘hot potatoes’. He even told the Chinese M’sian then that the Merdeka University could only be setup IFF when the iron tree bore flowers!
He had offended the Chinese M’sians. He knew that the political survival of the mca was now dependent on the supports of the umno & the Malay M’sians. Thus, started the ‘kowto’ism of mca to umno - as majority of the mca politicians could only be elected with the help of the Malay electorates. Situation turned worst after the onset of May13, just like T Dr Ismail’s description of mca as ‘hidup enggan mati tak mau’.
Right up to the independence, the citizenship of non-Malay Malayan is never an issue as there were already 3 million+ non-Malays, fully qualified as the citizen of Malaya. Their citizenship status was NON QUID PRO QUO. There have NEVER been a relaxing of citizenship rules for them after Merdeka as always claimed by umno bigots. The claim of “…we being generous endlessly…” is a fragment of umno imagination, period.
BTW, the Malay M’sian does get some helps in return for their ‘lack of progresses’ in certain areas. The SPECIAL POSITIONS as enshrined in the articles of the federal Constitutions r proofs of sufficiently & ‘wrongly & unashamedly claimed perpetuate’ for the Malay M’sians.
If one look at the constant shifting of the NEP goal post then this phrase should apply;
“They are forever wanting more and more. The moment they become rich & then lost it they want more extensions & benefits. Now they demand perpetuate without any thought of shame to their race & religion. Why do we allow that when it was agreed ONLY for a certain time frame?”
Could it be that the section that pulls ahead has inside them, an ideology of struggle imbued? That perhaps the response to the Toynbeean challenge within that section of society left behind has not been adequate?
A very interesting question that you posed here dato. And this is the first time I heard of Toynbeean challenge. A quick google, I am able to extract the passage below and understand as to what are you driving at which is quite consistent with what you have been talking all along.
In primitive societies, as we know them, mimesis or imitation is directed towards the older generation and towards dead ancestors who stand, unseen but not unfelt, at the back of the living elders, reinforcing their prestige. In a society where mimesis is thus directed backward towards the past, custom rules and society remains static. On the other hand, in societies in process of civilization, mimesis is directed towards creative personalities who commanded a following because they are pioneers. In such societies, "the cake of custom," as Walter Bagehot called it in his Physics and Politics, is broken and society is in dynamic motion along a course of change and growth.
Maybe I continue later.. got to go to sleep, got an early morning errand to run tommorrow.
kuldeep,
i hear you and i agree 100% your views! Malays need not regard themselves as somehow inadequate. There is no such genetic trait as inadequacy in any race!
Affirmative action is fine, but there must be a deadline for the objectives to be achieved. And the primary objective must be to develop competence, competitiveness and human capital. Otherwise the affirmative action programmes will just be an endless series of free lunches.
Dato Sak, this is a good question:
"Could it be that the section that pulls ahead has inside them, an ideology of struggle imbued?"
I say no. CIRCUMSTANCES force people to respond.
Let's not forget that the first chinese immigrants here were the underclass. Most had no money, all had no rights of citizenship. As such they were extremely vulnerable segment of society. And they still had to find a way to survive despite the odds. if the chinese are economically dominant today, it is despite the difficulties they faced.
My own family is a good case study on how circumstances mould our responses.
As i had said, my uncle was given preference, privileges and protection all his life. and he turned out an utter failure in the end.
His sister, my mum, was treated as something of a maid of the family. My dad was abandoned and had to start working at age 5 to earn his keep.
They both worked their way up in life and was able to give us kids a comfortable middle-class life.
So Dato Sak, there is no such thing as cultural makeup at the genetic level. Individual responses to circumstances will determine the characteristics of a culture. If enough people respond in a certain way, then a culture is created.
As you have said, the desire to succeed cannot be legislated. That's why i proposed the concept of keagungan Melayu. because when enough Malays succeed in their pursuit of personal eminence, a culture of eminence will emerge.
kuldeep has a valid point about this when he mentioned Mazlan and Dahlan. They succeeded not with know-who but with know-how, anchored in their own personal eminence.
Look at these Malay economic heroes. Learn their traits. Emulate their success. Invite them to conduct trainings. Ask them to mentor new entrepreneurs.
This way, the Malays will no longer need the NEP in 20 years. They WILL control their fair share of the economy. And they would have done it by themselves, competing on equal footing.
Salam hormat, Dato
I agree with Kuldeep that the measure of success is not about billions.It should be about pioneering into high growth areas and taking a leadership position.
I reckon Les Copaques,the creators of Upin and Ipin falls in this category.They have managed to coral the skillsets developed through our Multimedia University into a tangible leadership position in an industry with good prospects going forward.
And they are also providing training to a lot of Bumis.
They deserve more assistance to cement their position.
Mr Kuldeep,
Persepsi awak kepada Malays lah yg membuat kamu sentiasa berprasangka kepada kami, Melayu. But since you always compare and find yourself superior than Malays on certain areas, make you think yg kami semua tak boleh berubah.
I think you and your perception yg membuatkan you sendiri terasa.
We know apa kelebihan dan kekurangan kami dan sedia berubah. But you mengambil kesempatan untuk membuat org lebih marah kepada kamu, Mr Kuldeep.
You should learn how to respect other people, samada punya kelebihan dan kekurangan.
Otherwise, you better find tempat lain yg sama taraf strugglenya dengan you, if not duk sini lama2 sakit hati woo!
Mungkin ramai yg akan tolong kepergian anda dari Bumi Malaysia ini. We will ensure your easy exit from Malaysia. We will make a farewell party for you selama berbakti kepada Malaysia, segala harta pencarian di Malaysia ditinggalkan utk membantu rakyat miskin and with certain amount of "duit poket" untuk you memulakan kehidupan di sana, and of course your citizenship kena ambil baliklah.
We hope you can find a first class experience in other country you choose to live.
As a father I can only promise my children that I can feed them and give them the opportunity to have the best education that is within my means.
I do wish I can leave them Rm 20 million in the bank each on top of that education but unfortunately I am also in need of a few hundred thousands for my retirement years.
My children understand that and they also know that they will have to take care of themselves in the future when daddy is too old to go to the office (or rather no one wants the services of this old codger anymore )...so they have to work hard for their education.
So,my kids are now under the Daddy Economic Policy but they realise that it will end someday.
Wah Al-Minangkabaui,
Your 2 Apr 23:05 is the best comment on NEP in blogosphere that I've read so far. Kudos.
Indeed, it's the abuse in implementation that Kuldeep also touched upon in his comment.
Kuldeep,
I'm afraid I disagree with you completely with your opinion that a permanent NEP might lead to not much of the cake left by the time our kids grow up.
I'm no economist but I simply can't imagine it. The cake will always be there unless the country goes bankrupt. Even then, it'd be temporary and the cake will grow again. Even Brazil, Argentina, other Latin American and many African countries got out of the throes of economic chaos in the past.
However, I agree with you on the need to develop and expand Malay medium-sized businesses with good assets, strong management and prudent investment of their hard-earned money.
After this short comment I'm going to ignore Anon 3 Apr 00:01 and the usual opportunistic EWO who often jump in to exploit any points expressed that favour their nature of wanting more and more. They often come in about the same time -was it planned, co-ordinated? I often wonder if malays participated in their blogs, especially in Chinese language (one commentator somewhere said the Malays went in droves to send their kids to SJK schools). Maybe the ideology of struggle Dato Sak spoke about also refers to the nature of the Malays who, as a race, are not opportunistic and exploitative. Long Jaafar (who discovered tin) asking Penang Chinese to operate his tin mines in Larut in the 1850s comes to mind.
The Anon fellow has his own version of Malaysian history. Or the Wikipedia always-changing versions. As I have said before, I can produce a still-living former Registrar of Nationals who himself relaxed, following policy, the language proficiency regulations (language tests etc) when approving non-Malay citizenship applications well after Merdeka. Never relaxed citizenship rules? What is he talking about? This kind denies such things so that they don't have to be grateful. Sad, but let's ignore them.
Anon 00:01
Di bawah pemerintahan Islam, hak org Islam lebih sedikit dari bukan Islam. (in terms of pentadbiran negara dan pengawalan ekonomi.)Reason being, pemerintah mestilah beragama Islam dan mengawal negaranya untuk menjamin kesejahteraan dan kedaulatan agamanya dan rakyatnya. Juga kerana bilamana, kamu bukan Islam, tidak mengetahui dengan terperinci tentang hal2 ugama Islam, sudah tentu kamu tak dapat menjalankan apa yg sepatutnya disaran dalam Islam.
Itulah asasnya negeri Islam, if u wanna stay and suka undang2 itu, kamu stay, kalau tak suka, boleh pergi. No one stopping you.
I would like to ask apa sebenarnya kamu bukan Islam nak? Hidup aman atau nak memerintah? Kalau memerintah, memang tak boleh.
Part of problem yg kita hadapi sekarang ni, kerana British telah memasukkan nenek moyang kamu semua, dan kami Melayu kena bertanggungjawab untuk mengatasi masalah ini. Boleh kah kamu cari negeri lain seperti Malaysia, yg pemerintahnya Islam dan dalam masa yg sama punya rakyat yg agamanya berlainan. Arab pun kalau ada yg kristian, tapi mereka bangsa Arab.
You can't compare dengan US. sana majority semua bukan Islam dan pemerintahnya pun bukan Islam.
So i guess, you are not comparing apple to apple. So, US as a precedent, is out of question. So, janganlah kamu mencari salah kamu senantiasa, bilamana kami dilambakkan dengan masalah oleh orang2 British tu. Guna akal sikit, jangan tamak haloba tak cukup2 nak itu dan ini.
Tapi bukan bermakna bila hak itu lebih, kaum bukan islam dianiaya. Tidak. Orang yg bukan Islam dibawah naungan pemerintah Islam, haknya dilindungi dan keselamatan nya dijaga sama rata dengan hak org2 Islam.
Kalau mengikut zaman Rasullulah atau mungkin Khulafa, bukan Islam dikenakan bayaran Jizyah, kalau tak silap akujanji menjadi rakyat dan mengaku setia. Selagi kamu setia, keselamatan dan kebebasan kamu hidup dan berniaga dijamin.
Malah pemerintah negeri itu akan mempertahankan kamu, yg bukan Islam lebih dahulu jika dibanding dengan Islam di luar diluar negara dan bukan rakyatnya.
Principle : Selagi kamu rakyatnya, keselamatan kamu dijamin (Islam dan bukan Islam) lagi lebih diutamakan dari seorang Islam yg berada di luar negerinya.
Mr Anon...
Thanks for the proposed farewell..but regretfully I have nowhere else to go cos I am born in Malaysia as were my parents.
I am also a Melayu but in the context of our discussions its irrelevant.
I believe we (the Malays) are capable of change...that we have seen many examples of Malays who have succeeded in many2 fields even without govt assistance.You ask Dato Sak about Zaman..the nasi lemak man (as a very simple example of hard work,know how and focussed business sense.)
The main thrust of my comment is that with properly constructed affirmative action embracing ppl who are willing to blood,sweat and tears to develop and hv the knowhow in their respective fields;the programme will give better returns.
Not many ppl wants to be contractors BUT everyone wants to hv a nego contract.Lets find ways to gv nego contracts to those who want and can be contractors and NOT those who will flip the contract the next second and go on to buy a Cayenne.
Penambahan:-
Part of the problem .......Boleh kah kamu cari negeri lain seperti Malaysia, yg pemerintahnya Islam dan dalam masa yg sama punya rakyat yg agamanya dan BANGSANYA berlainan. Arab pun kalau ada yg kristian, tapi mereka TETAP berbangsa Arab.That reduce their problems.
If you wish to stay, please shut up and stop being a tamak haloba kind of person...
Please abide the rules given to you..
Kalau pergi sekolah, ikut undang2 sekolah, masuk Universiti pun ada undang, sumtime you may not like all undang2 or by-laws tu...but you still follow? May i ask you why?
If you have the answer, keep it to yourself and understand. We dont care you are a Malay or non-Malay but undang2 adalah undang2..kalau tak boleh hidup dengan undang2..carilah tempat yg tak punya undang2...well, with our best wishes to you..happy struggling over there..
see whether you like the place, when there is such thing as undang2, and all are equal. Am I right? Or you still didnt get our point..
Have a good nite sleep over there.. heheh..
see whether you like the place, when there is NO such thing as undang2, and all are equal.
"The question is, if the environment that presides over all of us is common, how is it that one section can pull ahead of us, while the rest stagnates? Could it be that the section that pulls ahead has inside them, an ideology of struggle imbued?"
Dato Sak is driving the ship towards the corner of eugenics & bell-curve.
Perhaps unintentionally?
Between the Malay & the Chinese, the contrasting conclusion is glaring. No need to elaborate any more. Strong/weak culture? No?
Between the rich & poor Malays, the huge gap of the Gini Coeff among Malays sets the record.
In fact, this dichotomy spits right into one's face if the life-styles of those fat-cats in Felcra/Felda r compared with those of the peneroka tanah. These air-con paper-pushing fat-cats have millions in assets while those hardworking land tillers r living on day-to-day hardship.
In fact, these Felcra/Felda land cultivators have more guts & stamina than those aircon office dwellers! They should be the one that should be enjoying a decent live through their attitudes & hardwork. Instead, they keep tilling the land to earn a 'maggot' living from the day they were given the land!
What gives?
Same race, same culture ma!
'Know-who' technology that those land tillers know & yet r unable to practice?
30+ yrs have passed & yet the wealth enjoyed by those well-connected Malays is not filtering down to those that they r supposed to look after & uplift!
Many of u, instead keep asking for the NEP to prolong, without seriously looking for an end-all solution.
Could this be because somehow this group of people is been sacrificed to provide REASONS for those fat-cats to continuing enjoying their 'god' given 'rights' under the disguise of target not meet?
To those genome apologists, these r thoughts to be explored!
gwlnet
gwlnet
Jangan baling batu sembunyi tangan ok. We know what u really want. The hidden agenda.
Tak yah nak sibuk2 fat cats segala.
You may say everything and anything under the sun but the prime objective (hidden agenda) that we are very much concern
Ha, this gwlnet fellow comes again.
Now he talks about strong and weak culture. Elsewhere I read his kind saying that the strong culture will prevail. The neighbour down under (where this gwlnet fellow stayed for years and which he glorifies and holds in awe) once said the Malays have no culture.
What strong culture are they talking about? Historians have written about them practising Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism all at the same time without any sense of incompatibility. They ran away from south China during the period when life was simply intolerable under the Manchus, a foreign power that conquered and ruled them for several hundred years. Many entered the then Malaya. History has recorded the clan warfare, secret societies and gangsterism that they brought from China and practised in Perak, Selangor and elsewhere. Is this the strong culture that this fellow talks about? Now that they have enjoyed a much better life here, can't they pause once in a while and think about being grateful? In Thailand they have to be totally assimilated, in the Philippines they dress and speak Tagalog, in Indonesia they were for a long time not allowed their lion dances. And are still being spitted at behind their backs.
Don't get me wrong. The vast majority of Malaysian Chinese are good, grateful and loyal citizens. Only the "Malaysian Malaysia" kind need to think of the above, don't distort or re-write Wikipeadia- type history of the country your forfathers helped to make peaceful and worth living in.
We want peace in this country for now and future generations. If your kind doesn't understand or want that, or want to try life elsewhere, nobody is forcing you to stay.
Elsewhere this fellow dared to say that the communist terrorists should be given credit in Malaysian history. Imagine, those who killed thousands of our Police and Army personnel, plus many innocent civilians, disrupted the economic life of the country, caused curfew to be imposed in many parts of the country for decades.
Let's leave it to the authorities to handle his kind. We should just ignore them. However much you argue will not change the kind of mindset they have. They will always dig out the half truths and distort facts of history to suit their agenda.
Addendum to my 12:02 comments -
I'm not an UMNO member, never was. So don't start syaing what I said above is UMNO propaganda or UMNO related.
We, Malays, like to live in a self fulfilling prophecy.....and the best thing is how easy is for the government to con us into it.
1) UMNO says Malay lemah, we say yes kita lemah;
2) UMNO says Cina tamak, we say yes cina tamak;
3) UMNO says Cina nak menjajah, we say yes cina nak menjajah;
4) UMNO says Melayu akan merosot kalau takde NEP, we say yes Melayu akan merosot kalau takde NEP;
5) UMNO says Melayu tak boleh bertanding dengan Cina, we say yes kita tak boleh bertanding.
6) UMNO says Melayu tak kaya, yes we say kita tak kaya.
....dan banyak lagi.
Kalau tak tau apa tu Self fulfilling prophecy, bacalah sendiri...
"If a person thinks we are clever or stupid or whatever, they will treat us that way. If we are treated as if we are clever, stupid or whatever, we will act, and even become, this way. The person has thus had their prophecy about us fulfilled!
This is also known as the Pygmalion Effect."
http://changingminds.org/explanations/theories/self-fulfilling_prophecy.htm
Sedarlah sekarang orang Melayu. Jangan kita selalu dibutakan oleh kerajaan dengan kenyataan-kenyataanya untuk menutupkan kelemahannya untuk :-
1) mengawal korupsi pegawai sivil dari pegawai kecil sampai the tahap menteri, dari sekolah sampai ke universiti, dari polis sampai ke ACA, dari JPJ sampai ke Kastam, dari syarikat negeri sampai ke GLC dan banyak lagi;
2) memberi nilai perkhidmatan untuk kita yang paling tinggi supaya kita boleh hidup aman, damai dan dapat tumpukan tenaga untuk mencari hidup yang lebih selesa;
3) menyatukan semua warga-warga Malaysia supaya kita boleh berkerja sama untuk bertanding di dunia. Ekonomi kita sepatut lebih pesat dari Singapura, Taiwan dan Hong Kong yang tidak ada sebarang hasil semulajadi spt minyak, balak atau timah. Lihatlah betapa kita mengundur dari ekonomi kecil ini;
4) gagal untuk memberi pendidikan yang berkualiti tinggi. Graduan-graduan universiti keluar tak dapat kerja kerana apa yang sudah belajar sudah lama ketinggalan dalam zaman taknologi tinggi ini; Bagi masuk pelajar-pelajar lemah kerana NEP dan diberi kelulusan dengan skim permarkahan yang rendah untuk menunjuk NEP berjaya. Ini adalah kerja penipuaan dan tidak memberi gambaran yang nyata kepada pelajar-pelajar itu.
5) gagal untuk memberi sekolah-sekolah kebangsaan yang berkualiti tinggi sehingga orang cina terpaksa menghantar anak mereka ke sekolah cina kerana mutu dan disiplin lebih tinggi sedikit dari sekolah kebangsaan. Tapi anak-anak mereka keluar sekolah, bahasa melaysia tak boleh pakai dan bahasa ingerris pun tak boleh pakai. Bagi orang cina yang paling penting adalah pendidikan anak-anak mereka. Kalau, kerajaan boleh beri sekolah kebangsaan yang bermutu tinggi dan pendidikan yang ada kaitan dengan dunia perniagaan sebenar, boleh jamin, sekolah cina boleh bungkus dan mati semulajadi.
dan banyak lagi...
Consider the situation of 2 persons with A living in a nice controlled air-conditioned environment and B at our normal room temperature of 30 degrees C. Under normal circumstances, would A get out of his nice environment to go live under B’s condition ? But if there is a power failure and the nice environment cannot be supported anymore, will A be able to survive under harsher conditions than those that he is so used to ? Living things grow stronger under harsh environments. This is where survival of the fittest comes in.
Forget about the thousand over years history that the Chinese or Indians have. This is here and now. An intelligent father does not necessarily pass all his intelligence to his children. Similarly, there are many cases of intelligent people with ordinary parents. You can only depend on yourself.
The only way to move forward is honesty and hardwork. A toddler will never learn how to walk unless you let go of your hands and let them stand on their own. Success is 99% perspiration and 1% inspiration. Even if the durian falls in front of you, you still need to pick it up and open it to enjoy the fruit. If TDM with his passion and mindset for the Malays cannot improve his brethren in 22 years, which other perceived leader can do better than him ? So better depend on yourself.
So stop all this moaning and groaning about no opportunities, ‘know-who’ and privileges. So stop dreaming and go look for the opportunities and just do it. Ada NEP kah atau tak ada kah, life goes on. No one is going to feed you but yourself.
According to my chinese friends, although the Malays have their NEP, in real situation, theres nothing to compare with what the Chinese have enjoyed. They had enjoyed better arrangement compared to what NEP had offered us.
So, at least according to him, it is okay that NEP have accomodate us so far.
They (Chinese) enjoyed some other privileges among themselves without us knowing it.
Anon11:33
Go ahead - mentioned the hidden agenda.
Could it be as anon12:57’s - 3) UMNO says Cina nak menjajah, we say yes cina nak menjajah;
U r paranoid & still living under the tempurung! R u chicken little reborn? At least Chicken little worries about the sky is falling down & yet u r scaring sick of falling tempurung!
Get real & get a life. What anon12:57 mentioned in (3) can never happen even if the Chinese M’sians have the number & power.
So - keep on worry & make yr life miserable, ok?
Anon12:02
I should have ignored u after telling u off about 2nd serving. Well, let me give u a parting shot;
1)Don’t put yr own words into others write-ups. If u don’t understand what’s been written then ask. There is NO shame in asking. But what u do now is definitely NO No & very bad etiquette. It shows yr up-bringing!
2)If u wanted to debate, then don’t do it with ad hominem arguments! It again show yr true character, & all yr subsequent points r loss; u have no valid points except personal attacks
3)I happened to like umno members - Dato Sak & Wenger – through their writings. Political affiliation doesn’t add weights to yr points putting forward. Yr intelligence does. So r u showing any?
Man can generally be divided into 4 categories: 1st class r those with intelligence & principles; 2nd class r those with limited intelligence but true principles; 3rd class, not intelligent & no principles; & bottom up r those most despicable; with full intelligence & yet no principles.
Do ponder about this for yr own personal development. & THIS is yr last serving!
gwlnet
Gwlnet
If u r not scaring sick of falling tempurung, why dont you accept NEP?
Why bother with all those when u preach that you are the best compare with the Malays in terms of culture.
Isnt that called scared too? You are scared you could not do things your way in our country huh?
Mereka suka hantar sekolah cina, sebab takmau anak2 depa tak reti tulis cina. Depa takut anak depa pandai cakap melayu dari cina.
Yep, lepas tu klai nak tu dan ini, tapi tak menjunjung adat negeri ni.
Mana ada jalan...Aku agak yg terlepas ke malaysia ni yg jahat2 belaka. Duduk negeri sendiri pun kena perambat ngan tuan tanah sana, datang sini mau jadi gangster ha?
Kita kasi perambat sama dia....
(Dah dalam darah gamaknya, dulu jenis tak reti diuntung, dah beberapa generasi pun masih tak reti diuntung lagi)
Suruh dia duduk negeri komunis ajalah.
Dato' Sak,
Some of the comments here are getting quite ugly. Maybe you should consider moderating them.
I once came across a study on perception on NEP conducted in the early 80's. The researcher was neutral and the methodology very sound. Sampling was also quite representative. Results showed a high level of positive attitude towards NEP both among the Chinese and Indians.
Similar studies done in the past ten years, by non-politically alligned researchers have shown a massive swing of opinion. So, the question is why? What happened between then and now?
I too have great respect to TDM but really, as smart a man he was, no matter how good his intentions were, his method was wrong.
I have no standing to say much on this but the next time you interview Kuli, please ask him, what happened? What was it about TDM's ways and methods in politics and economics that brought us to this current state we are in. I've followed Kuli (his thoughts and ideas through his speeches, interviews etc) since the early 80's, and I firmly believe had he succeeded in 1987, he could've done things very differently. Abuses in the implementation of NEP of course had began during his tenure as finance minister, but at least he was firm in trying to control it. TDM and TDZ were all about implementing their vision and own ideas, which they believed to be superior than others. So, by hook or by crook, they will ensure its realization regardless whether others agree or not. That's why they never believed in open tender systems, transparency etc. For them, it's a waste of time (which I sense a belief that you share as well). "I know I'm right so why bother listen to others".
If our new PM's vision of reform is to revert back to this philosophy, the future looks bleak for this country.
"That perhaps the response to the Toynbean challenge within that section of the community has not been adequate".
Memang lah tak cukup. Belom cukup. Tapi apa ada tahap boleh cukup bila di banding dengan pengalaman dan kemahiran pihak saing? Apa yang kita boleh buat, secara praktikal?
Kita sudah lihat berbagai respon dalam semua bidang. Respon dalam bidang perniagaan kita sudah dengar banyak penulisan. Bidang astro physics pun kita ada - Dr Mazlan sudah lama lulus dalam bidang itu. Kalau tak silap nuclear scientist pun ada - Dr Nor Ramli, mengetuai Atomic Research Centre dahulu. Tapi kemana kita dalam bidang sains dan teknologi sekarang? Apa matlamat kita bila astronot Melayu tumpang roket Russia ke angkasa raya?
Apa matlamat struggle kita pada keseluruhan nya? Apa vision nya. Bukan kah kita tahu matlamat dahulu bahru kita ciptakan ideologi nya?
Malang nya, mana matlamat dan vision kita yang ada sudah di hijack oleh berbagai masaelah yang melanda2 dalam suasana pemerintahan yang lemah. Politik wang, rasuah, gejala kroni, birokrat yang tidak dapat panduan yang nyata dari pemerintah tentang langkah2 yang patut di ambil, bayangan kebebasan bercakap-tindak, membahas dan menyo'al perkara2 sensitif dan sebagai nya.
Sekarang kita ada Kerajaan bahru. Boleh kah kita harapkan semua ini bertukar? Boleh kah satu matlamat yang nyata dan satu ideologi perjuangan timbul? Kita lihat lah bayangan nya dari lantikan kabinet bahru minggu depan.
The vision is to make umno leaders and their cronies ultra rich thru affirmative action...and the ideology is to arouse racial concerns amongst malays so as to demand the continuance of the NEP.
Show me an umno leader who earns no more than 300k per annum with assets commensurate to his earnings..
chinese hidden agenda la...
chinese got better deal la...
chinese version of history la...
chinese better-than-NEP privileges la...
chinese buy cheaper houses and goods than Malay la...
plenty of accusations. But we have yet to hear a single sliver of substantiation.
Is this merely a case of repeating a lie enough times to be bought as the truth?
Tengok tu mentaliti nya. Kan orang dah cakap bukan semua Cina macam tu. Dia cakap macam kita kata semua cina buat begitu.
Dia ni bahaya punya orang. Tak pikir apa dia cakap. Tak hati hati apa dia tulis.
Tengok komen 03:27 tu pulak.
Komen bahasa Cina 03:27 tu dia dah padam ka?
Yang di ateh ni tak baca ka hujah2, fakta2 sejarah yang orang dah bagi? Pulak dia kata tak substantiate.
Baca lah komen2 yang panjang tu. Ka dia saja tak mahu pecaya? Tak mahu terima?
Tak usah peduli dia lah.
Ini nak kata saja untuk rekod.
Anon 03 April 2009 15:58
I believe u & the chicken little r of the same person.
I don’t fear NEP! It gives me strength to fight my own battle on my own terms - no hand-outs, no easy short-cuts & no weakling paranoid about my future.
When time turns worst, these r the trainings that will make me survive in this very practical world.
Can u?
Let me tell u why I don’t accept NEP, from my contacts with the Felda/Felcra settlers;
There was a study done by GoldmanSach in 2003 (I think), about the leakage cost of NEP since its implementation in 1970. The cost was estimated to be at least US$300 Billion.
Now let’s do some trivial & simplified number crunching, that most of the Joe M’sians can understand.
M’sia has 26M people, of which 60% is of Bumiputra status. That gives a figure of 15.6M Malay M’sians.
Now, US$300B leakage over 33 yrs (1970-2003), gives US$9.1B per yr.
Spread this figure over the Malay populace of 15.6M, that’s a figure of US$583 per Malay per yr.
Now, back to reality – how much has the income of the peneroka tanah of Felda/Felcra (just a sampling, as Felda/Felcra starts as the baby product of NEP) been improved over the same period?
Remember also this is the additional money that will go into their household IFF there is no leakages.
Now how many millionaires r been ‘created’ from the offices of the Felda/Felcra? Does any conscientious Malay M’sians know/care?
There r many calls for the restructure of the NEP implementations, so that the ‘goodies’ can be spread ‘wide & better’. But… but 30+ yr has created a monster that feeds unto itself. The organisation is so deep rooted & well-structured that no amounts of effort can/will restructure it & prevent it from REVERT back to self-exploit.
And who r the numbers that is forever at the bottom?
The poor segment of the Malay M’sians, who need the most helps! They r the collateral damage of the NEP, the statistic that help to perpetuate its on-going implementation!
Never mind also about the weakling stigmas that forever been labeled onto all the Malay M’sians, irrespective of their own efforts!
gwlnet
gwlnet
Menyalahkan NEP kepada punca semua ini adalah keterlaluan dan nampak sangat agenda kau nak jatuhkan NEP sahaja..
I dont think all problems in this worlds revive on issue only..
It more than than 1 problem to create such a bigger problems
Otak yg waras takkan dapat menerima hanya sebab NEP shj.There are a lot more than that.
Your desperado on attacking NEP has clearly shown of what you hated most and one could easily identify it.
It takes thousands and millions of lies to support one lie.
However, it wont work to most of us. U sounded as someone from SRJK Cina.
Thanks for working so hard with all your analysis and comment and it surely did showing ur own true color.
Abu Luqman
I read your 3 Apr 09 comment after being awakened by some noise and cannot easily sleep again this early in the morning. Rather late in this posting and these views are superseded by those in newer postings, but let me say a few words.
I agree with you whole-heartedly regarding TDM and TDZ. Books have been written by UM Economics Professors about the wanton use of GLCs like Pernas, Petronas, Ministry of Finance Inc, about political patronage, cronyism, the giving of facilities, advantages and preferences to UMNO-linked companies and "the Paremba boys" during TDM and TDZ time.
It's good to know that there are others who also feel bad about those things. The NEP objective was understandable but the beneficiaries were limited to those with UMNO links and appeared to serve the purpose of perpetuating power. These went on during the Abdullah years where nepotism became a pronounced feature. Hopefully these can be curtailed, perhaps even completely stopped, during Najib's era.
I pray for the dawn of a new beginning and for a cabinet reflective of these hopes and aspirations.
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